bob
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I'm too old to be nice but never too old to learn!
Posts: 1,457
Location: Northern California
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Post by bob on May 24, 2023 22:42:31 GMT -5
Which of these two methods of defensive handgun use do you or would you employee? Either pointing or aiming and under what conditions? I utilized both at 15 yds. closer than that I relied strickly on pointing as I don't believe there would be enough time for aiming and if there was time you could likely evade the issue completely. Your thoughts please.
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Post by hacker54 on May 25, 2023 9:29:18 GMT -5
Agree Bob. Inside 15 yards it would be place the front sight on the area of center mass and you will be on target. If you have time to align the sights then you should be looking at getting away from the situation.
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SnapShot
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Jeep & Mocha "Remembering Patches, always"
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Location: Finally free from the Republic of Kalifornia!
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Post by SnapShot on May 25, 2023 11:41:43 GMT -5
I'm in agreement with both of you. Inside the magic 21 ft line I practice with point shooting. With practice you can be in the critical hit area. That is typical of what you might encounter in Home Defense (most homes don't have rooms large enough to put the bad guy further away than that). If the distance is greater that that I'm counting on time to get sight picture and alignment all set (again practice). Like Bob said, in those cases I also want to evade the issue completely, if possible.
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poohzilla
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Give me a place to stand and a long-enough lever, and I will invariably break the lever.
Posts: 1,050
Location: New Hamster
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Post by poohzilla on May 25, 2023 18:19:51 GMT -5
Bob, I'm thinking along the same lines. You do need to be ready for both, but the more distance you have the more time you have, to either aim or better, get away. As far as technique, if you have access to a copy of "No Second Place Winner" by Bill Jordan, he provides some interesting tips-nothing you couldn't sort out yourself, but he organized it well and showed how things fit together. I picked up a used copy at abebooks.com for little more than postage. (I use those guys a lot. I have a bad reading habit...)
Obviously, the best place to be in a gunfight is elsewhere. A friend of mine was on the DMZ in Korea back during the rumblings there back in '68. He had an M-16 and three thrity round magazines full of tracer. He claims his plan was if the North Koreans rolled, he was going to use the tracer to set the dry grass on fire so he could run away in the smoke. Ok, he tells it better...
Meanwhile, practice, practice, practice !
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bob
Member
I'm too old to be nice but never too old to learn!
Posts: 1,457
Location: Northern California
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Post by bob on Jul 15, 2023 14:21:49 GMT -5
To day I shot my new Shield MP9 for qualification, I now have to rethink point vs aim, I did well but had to aim. I have found that, like a shotgun, fit is extremely important. It may be that practice will in time over come or offset the fit issue but 'till then it will be aim. I did find the sights to be excellent almost natural in terms of target acquisition.
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gws
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Posts: 969
Location: NW New Mexico
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Post by gws on Jul 15, 2023 21:05:20 GMT -5
I have a very close friend (probably in his last year of life) who retired years ago as a local police sergeant, who also had to defend himself during a family altercation. (he said they were the worst kind....emotions totally out of control) He successfully survived only because he was trained well. He said there were the 2 main rules: 1: Stay out of reach to be tackled, 2: NEVER let an opponent be close enough to grab for or swat your gun. He was trained to point shoot inside a dwelling or if someone makes it inside 1. or 2., by holding the gun close to the body, then extending the arms toward the opponent, while squeezing the trigger. He said he was told that's a natural motion you have an instinct for....that's what point and shoot means.....BUT he also said to get your head down in line with the weapon if possible with a quick slight squat....for two reasons....makes the point-line at eye (and brain) level, and second "usually" makes you a smaller target.....
We went out shooting together years ago where he demonstrated.....very impressive.....not surprised he survived and the perp didn't. Three quick pops...two to the chest and one to the head on the target in two seconds. (something he practiced every week, and no I am not nearly as fast or accurate...but I've gotten better) I think I have the details right, but it's been years....
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SnapShot
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Jeep & Mocha "Remembering Patches, always"
Posts: 699
Location: Finally free from the Republic of Kalifornia!
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Post by SnapShot on Jul 18, 2023 9:29:09 GMT -5
In close quarters I have done well with point shooting. In my attempts to transition from Iron to Red-Dot sights I have not done well at all. I just ordered a Ruger MAX-9 with their new Ready-Dot sight. It’s new technology that requires no battery and has no adjustments. It is matched to the specific gun from the factory. It has a huge (15 MOA ) dot. It co-witnesses with a fiber optic front sight. My “theory” is that this will be good transition / training to more normal Red-Dot sighting. It should be here in a few days. I’ll let you know what I learn.
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Post by hacker54 on Jul 18, 2023 13:26:27 GMT -5
Since we are on this subject of sights and sight picture. I've found that those that have the tree dot system seem to do good when getting on target quicker than a plane front blade and notched rear whether adjustable or fixed. This is from my own time at the range. Oh this is rapid fire on target. If I'm going for tight groups then it's slow fire and lining the sights up as precise as I can get. Now I hope to get to the range to get my 41mag dialed in as I have a red dot on it.
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bob
Member
I'm too old to be nice but never too old to learn!
Posts: 1,457
Location: Northern California
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Post by bob on Jul 18, 2023 14:55:30 GMT -5
I have found over the years that, with a shotgun that fits properly, I can stand in more or less a shooting position, look at my target, close my eyes, shoulder the gun and be on target. I have been practicing this with my "registered" guns and the concept seems to work very well now to get the newbie dialed in. As was pointed out, I assumed you would open your eyes as I do! Good one Larry.
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bob
Member
I'm too old to be nice but never too old to learn!
Posts: 1,457
Location: Northern California
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Post by bob on Jul 18, 2023 14:56:13 GMT -5
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SnapShot
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Jeep & Mocha "Remembering Patches, always"
Posts: 699
Location: Finally free from the Republic of Kalifornia!
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Post by SnapShot on Jul 18, 2023 19:58:14 GMT -5
Maybe I'd do better if I closed my eyes too
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poohzilla
Member
Give me a place to stand and a long-enough lever, and I will invariably break the lever.
Posts: 1,050
Location: New Hamster
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Post by poohzilla on Jul 20, 2023 12:09:38 GMT -5
My only suggestion is to make sure you're practicing with both your dominant and weak hands. Since a health issue a decade or so back, I've devoted at least one magazine or cylinderful to left hand practice. Not enough, but better than I had previously been doing.
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SnapShot
Member
Jeep & Mocha "Remembering Patches, always"
Posts: 699
Location: Finally free from the Republic of Kalifornia!
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Post by SnapShot on Jul 20, 2023 12:40:52 GMT -5
That's a good idea. I should do that; I can't remember the last time I did any weak-hand practice.
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