jbnut
Member
Posts: 169 
Location: Warren, Pennsylvania
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Post by jbnut on Jul 16, 2014 19:37:08 GMT -5
So as you know I've been working on developing a "better" load for my .270Win rifle using the Hornady 140gr BTSP bullet. I have a good load using IMR 4064 but I've been trying other powders just to see if there is anything better. Well the bullets I've been using I purchased most likely in the 80's so I have picked up a couple of "new" boxes in the past few months.
Well I'm really close to deciding on a new load with IMR4831 but I only have 12 of the old bullets left so I break out a new box just to make sure they will shoot the same. I seat the first bullet of the "new" box and it's no where near the cannelure. With the old box the OAL would be 3.335 the "new" bullet it was 3.3565. So I get out a old bullet and compare to a new bullet and it looks like Hornady moved the cannelure about .165 from where it used to be and redesigned the front of the bullet also.
First off ,when did they redesign this bullet and why did they keep the same item number for it?
Now I guess I need to start from the beginning again to determine what the Max OAL for this bullet can be in my rifle. Maybe I'll just load the remaining 12 old bullets and wait for rifle season.
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Post by hacker54 on Jul 16, 2014 22:22:38 GMT -5
JB,
You don't have to go by the cannelure of a bullet. Just because it is there does not mean you have to go by that. Some of the bullets that I have tried I have loaded below and above the cannelure. I suggest that you go by what your manuals say for OAL then go from there. If you take notice that most Speer bullets do not have a cannelure. I have loaded Speer's Mag Tip in my 30/30 single shot the 150gr and to chamber properly it goes past the cannelure. I have some Hornady's 150gr Spire Point to load and looks like they will fall below the cannelure for the test loads. So what I'm saying is to go by OAL and not the cannelure. Maybe someone else can give more insight.
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jbnut
Member
Posts: 169
Location: Warren, Pennsylvania
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Post by jbnut on Jul 17, 2014 4:25:49 GMT -5
Gary, Without changing my seater die this bullet came out with a OAL that is .0215 longer than before. So now I'm wondering if the Ogive is also a little different and that I need to start over just like if I was changing to a different component. |
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Jul 17, 2014 4:49:21 GMT -5
JB, I have no idea when Hornady changed the bullet design. But this is a pretty common practice with any bullet manufacturer. They keep on changing all the time, some use the same product numbers while other use a new ones.
There is no telling who does what. Some change for improvement, some for commercial reasons, some because of new machinery and so on.
I’m with Gary that you should not be concerned about the cannelure. Just seat them at the "required" seating depth (this is the leading factor), you are good to go. But you also mentioned that the tip is a bit different, it’s possible that this has an effect on the bullet path. For your own peace of mind load them just like you did before (with the older bullets) and see how these new ones perform.
Any performance differences also may be contributed to the powder, IMR has improved the 4831 powder also since the 80's. In effect.....you might have a new load on your hands after all these years using the same components. A good chance it’s for the better! Most don’t even noticed that the powder has changed in the meanwhile. That’s not good thing by it self but I know more people who don’t take notice and keep on loading with the old load data than those who adjust the loads to the new data.
Keep us posted what your results are.
PJ.
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7mmmountaineer
Member
Time to face it I am a workaholic............
Posts: 521
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Post by 7mmmountaineer on Jul 17, 2014 6:05:58 GMT -5
JB Hornady started changing their bullets in the late 90's and early 00's. They made a lot of changes too from the tip to the base of the BT in this case they changed almost the entire profile of their bullets. Make a dummy round or break out a good OAL gauge for your rifle. The OAL you currently use on the old bullets might still be the OAL you need with the new ones. If that's the case just bump your die back and work up a load with the new bullets. The cann isn't what you need to be worried about like Pete and Gary have said.
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jbnut
Member
Posts: 169
Location: Warren, Pennsylvania
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Post by jbnut on Jul 17, 2014 9:19:36 GMT -5
Thanks guys. It's just irritating to be so close and find out that the new box of bullets is completely different now. I guess I better get a couple more boxes of the new ones just to save the aggravation in case this happens again.
PJ, The IMR 4831 is new powder I picked this year but the IMR 4064 is powder from the 80's. I do have some new 4064 but I haven't opened that one up yet.
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Post by krwada on Jul 17, 2014 11:41:01 GMT -5
Thanks guys. It's just irritating to be so close and find out that the new box of bullets is completely different now. I guess I better get a couple more boxes of the new ones just to save the aggravation in case this happens again. PJ, The IMR 4831 is new powder I picked this year but the IMR 4064 is powder from the 80's. I do have some new 4064 but I haven't opened that one up yet. You only buy one box (100 count) at a time? Actually, I do the 100 count when I am trying to figure out whether or not using a specific projectile, (brand, style weight), is worthwhile. After the testing is complete ... then I load up ... usually 500 or 1000 at a time! IMR 4064 is an excellent medium burn powder. The only thing that is difficult about it is the stick grains are a bit long. It does not meter as easily as the ball or flake stuff. |
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7mmmountaineer
Member
Time to face it I am a workaholic............
Posts: 521
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Post by 7mmmountaineer on Jul 18, 2014 5:42:58 GMT -5
Thanks guys. It's just irritating to be so close and find out that the new box of bullets is completely different now. I guess I better get a couple more boxes of the new ones just to save the aggravation in case this happens again. PJ, The IMR 4831 is new powder I picked this year but the IMR 4064 is powder from the 80's. I do have some new 4064 but I haven't opened that one up yet. JB their are a lot of people including my wife that want nothing but 4831 in their 270's in her case H4831. However I do know a few people here that run nothing but 4064 both AA and IMR in their 270's I know a few that run the same powders in their 06's too. Try you new bullets with both powders you might be surprised to find both powders work. Yea and I am like Ken really only one box of bullets is a wow moment for me I never order less that a 300 count of any bullets I order just incase    ......... |
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jbnut
Member
Posts: 169
Location: Warren, Pennsylvania
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Post by jbnut on Jul 18, 2014 6:18:26 GMT -5
I believe I started with 2 boxes but as I said this was in the 80's. As you can tell I didn't do a lot of loading then it's this past year that I really got back into it and it has been a lot of fun. At least I'm good for something, everyone's entertainment.  |
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My daughter came from Missouri, my son and grand son, my wife and I had a nice dinner of grilled "porter house" pork chops, corn on the cobb, my son, G'son and I share 10/5. G'son is 4 minutes early though @ 10/4.
Pooh I hope you find to right house . 
