7mmmountaineer
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Time to face it I am a workaholic............
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Post by 7mmmountaineer on Feb 18, 2015 19:22:36 GMT -5
I have used a lot of W760 and H414 in the 7-08 over the years with bullets from Barnes, Hornady, Nosler and Sierra and have never had a complaint or issue. I have used data out of the bullet manufacturer manuals and the Hodgdon site many times. I had never looked at the data Speer lists in its book for the 2 bullet weights I most use of theirs 145 and 160 till a little bit ago. They list a CCI250 primer for their load which I think is over kill for the charge even though its a ball powder in this case W760. Their 145 load starts out just one grain under a max charge for the Hodgdon site. Dose the 145gr load look odd to anyone else or is it me. The 160gr load I get the numbers are not that far apart but the 145gr according to Speer give me pause. Do I think they are unsafe no but this round has an assigned CUP of 52,000. So is it me or would you think that Speer load would produce a lot higher CUP than the Hodgdon loads. Below is what is listed with both sources.
145GR SPEER Hodgdon site: Rem Brass/Rem 91/2 LR primer 43.0gr @2589fps 41,200 CUP 46.0gr @2788fps 49,500 CUP Speer book: Rem Brass/CCI 250 LRM primer 45.0gr @2628fps 49,0gr @2920fps
160GR SPEER Hodgdon site: Rem Brass/Rem 91/2 LR primer 42.5gr @2566fps 43,500 CUP 45.5gr @2684fps 49,600 CUP Speer book: Rem Brass/Rem 91/2 LR primer 41.0gr @2475fps 45.0gr @2735fps
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Post by krwada on Feb 18, 2015 19:28:45 GMT -5
I have found that the Hodgdon reloading data website, in general, to be at the low end of charge weight. I have also found that the Speer reloading manual to be at the high end of the charge weight. I have also found that the Lyman #49 is somewhere near the middle.
If the only data available is Hodgdon and Speer, then I take the average max charge weight from both sources as my MAX load. I start at the recommended 10% down from this number, (usually in line with the Hodgdon data), and work up from there to the average MAX calculated loads.
Now, that I got a chrono, doing this safely is not too much of a problem.
When confronting stuff like this, it is in general best to have the help from the chronograph.
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gws
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Location: NW New Mexico
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Post by gws on Feb 18, 2015 20:36:53 GMT -5
When I started loading in 1972 Hornady had the reputation of having hot loads on just about everything. Sierra and Speer were lower and according to Handloader Magazine more prudent.
It seems the opposite is true these days: Hornady and Sierra loads are usually similar, and seem to offer lower load data with every new manual they publish. Speer loads often start at the others' max. That's confusing to say the least. I have no idea who's right, but starting low with the lower sources seems wise.....then work up to Speer loads and watch for the signs.
I find this true with a lot of powder load data, not just W760.
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7mmmountaineer
Member
Time to face it I am a workaholic............
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Post by 7mmmountaineer on Feb 18, 2015 21:29:45 GMT -5
I am actually planning to try both bullets with that powder in my small primer experiment and was just wondering. I just got my LAPUA large primer 7-08 brass and want to do a side by side with them. I will start out at the Hodgdon start load and once I climb above 47gr reduce my steps to .2gr. I can not for the life of me think of a reason I never used the Speer data or even looked at it before today. I always used the Hodgdon data or the ave max I have from the other manuals I have. One thing for sure I don't see the need for a mag primer at this charge level so it will be a Fed 210M instead for my large primer brass.
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Post by hacker54 on Feb 18, 2015 23:47:52 GMT -5
In Speer's manual they state that they got more uniform results at the lower charge weights with ball powders using the mag primer.
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bob
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I'm too old to be nice but never too old to learn!
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Location: Northern California
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Post by bob on Feb 19, 2015 0:37:27 GMT -5
Chuck; I have been using H414/760 for years and have been using the CCi 200 primer with 140 gr. Sierra PHs. The load I use is a "Ruger only" load published by Hodgdon some time ago and I telephone them each time I get a new powder lot to confirm that it is still in limits. They have told me the magnum primers are important in cold climates for consistent ignition but not where I hunt, in fact I've had to back down 0.4 grs from max because of high ambient temperatures. Those loads you show seem to me consistent with what I load given the case volume difference. I think I would look at a little slower powder for the 160s though. One last thing, I seem to be looking at different manuals though as I typically find Hodgdon and Alliant loads to to more robust than the bullet manufacturers although Speer seems more potent than the rest at least for the cartridges I load. I will watch with interest for your results of your LP vs SP experiment,hopefully done in different temperatures.
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7mmmountaineer
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Time to face it I am a workaholic............
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Post by 7mmmountaineer on Feb 19, 2015 16:22:19 GMT -5
Bob I have some other powders H, AA and IRM 4350 plus H and IMR 4831 I can use. I have just always had very good accuracy and pretty good velocity with either 414 or 760 and heavy for caliber bullets in the 7-08. Now if I had my choice I would run Ramshot Hunter but I have yet to find even #1 kegs any place. That is also part of the reason for the 100V I really didn't work with it in my 7-08 other than a basic ladder and then I traded it off.
I will work with these powders and primers in as varied weather as I can Bob. I have a notebook that is strictly for this experiment and will run a file in my computer also. If it weren't for an icy mix I would actually try shooting Saturday afternoon it is supposed to be in the 30's.
I do have one oooops in my post Speer call for CCI250's with ball powder and 160gr bullets not Rem 91/2's. |
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gws
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Posts: 969
Location: NW New Mexico
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Post by gws on Feb 20, 2015 22:30:11 GMT -5
On TheFiringLine.com, thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=559068, there is a VERY good thread talking about this very subject generally. Something I knew about, generally, but I do have limited depth of knowlege here. Look at the posts from "UncleNick" and "BartB". Both guys I trust, having indepth knowlege you can bank on and what's more they are very good at explaining what they know. |
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7mmmountaineer
Member
Time to face it I am a workaholic............
Posts: 521
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Post by 7mmmountaineer on Feb 24, 2015 19:14:20 GMT -5
I ordered and received Lapua 7-08 larger primer brass. This experiment will work in play in well with my CCI BR4 experiment as well. I am going to fire form my new brass this weekend if weather hold the way it is supposed to. Then I will cycle my LP and SP Lapua brass side by side will work them from 43-47gr first if I see no signs of excessive pressure I will work it up from 47-49gr in .2 steps while watching for pressure signs. My LP brass will be run with Fed 210M primers.
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7mmmountaineer
Member
Time to face it I am a workaholic............
Posts: 521
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Post by 7mmmountaineer on Mar 14, 2015 10:32:55 GMT -5
Despite the rain and wind I am going to try and run a cycle today. All Lapua brass SP & LP.
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My daughter came from Missouri, my son and grand son, my wife and I had a nice dinner of grilled "porter house" pork chops, corn on the cobb, my son, G'son and I share 10/5. G'son is 4 minutes early though @ 10/4.
Pooh I hope you find to right house . 
